Wednesday at Takoma Station
Takoma Station, 6914 4th St NW, Washington, DC 20012

I went to Best Buy in Rockville to pick up more 8MM film for my scheduled interview with BJ. On my way back, I noticed that the free Rare Essence concert on the Strathmore Hall Lawn was going on despite the rain earlier in the afternoon. I passed up the rare opportunity to see GoGo in Bethesda (I have all 3 PAs performed in Bethesda that I know of: Northeast Groovers 1-7-94 Holton Arms, Backyard Band 11-08-96 Holton Arms, Fatal Attraction 10-24-03 Landon. Edit: I subsequently acquired a 4th: Chuck Brown 7-14-04 Strathmore Hall.) I arrived a little before 9 PM. Thomas stood outside and said hello. Packy was inside, setting up, I talked with him for a little while. I set up for the interview and waiting a few minutes for BJ. At the start, Doc kidded BJ about arriving early, BJ said that it would snow (it had hailed in DC earlier in the day). I conducted the interview.

JR: Other than entertainment, what purpose does GoGo have?

BJ: GoGo is like to me, it's like a culture for DC. You know what I'm saying, like Rap, they consider Rap and Hip Hop to be a culture for real. It's pretty much a culture. A lot of people don't understand GoGo unless they?ve... Well I shouldn't say that, well I grew up in it it's pretty much been everything to me, opened up doors for me so.

JR: What do you think is it about GoGo that makes it so popular?

BJ: The rhythm, you know what I'm saying, the rhythm, it's a unique rhythm. I don't care what kind of song you put over top of GoGo, a GoGo beat. You just distinctively know that, okay this is GoGo. It's got a very distinctive rhythm to it. I think that's pretty much what sets it apart.

JR: What do you feel about the fact that it is primarily a local phenomenon?

BJ: Say it again?

JR: What do you think about the fact that it is primarily local?

BJ: It's a good thing, but I think, I think it should be a world, a worldly thing. It's a lot of people outside of DC starting to pick up on it and use it to their advantage. But I don't know what it is about the artists here that they?re not able to capitalize on it and take it to that next level.

JR: Do you think a group of musicians from outside the DC area could produce a GoGo band that would be considered authentic here?

BJ: I don't think so. I mean given the track record of the people that I that tried...

JR: Like who?

BJ: Well not really a GoGo band per se but people that's done GoGo tracks like Jill Scott, I think a friend of Donnell?s, Marc Cary. I haven't really heard the material that he's done. Who else?

JR: Donnell's discussed how Rich Harrison has put GoGo into hit songs that he?s produced.

BJ: Yeah, right. Yeah, Beyonce, the Usher...

JR: What do you think about the way PA Tapes are presently sold?

BJ: Oh man, it's straight up black market. That's all I can say about that. It's black market. It should be sold just like a record companies sells with bar code and the writers getting their royalties off of it just like any other CD or album that?s sold.

JR: Yeah, that's interesting actually. That's one of the in a way advantages that they have of selling it on the black market right now is because there?s so much cover material...

BJ: Right.

JR: and it would be harder to license the...

BJ: That's true. That is true. But it's only cover material, a lot of it is because that?s what, that?s what people want to hear, but at the end of the day you can always go in the studio and just bang out some originals. There's a lot of groups that just play originals, I think Whop-N-Em is a prime example. The guy Whop and his group, I think they play pretty much all original material if I?m not mistaken.

JR: How often do you think a GoGo band should release a commercial album especially a studio album?

BJ: I would say once a month or once every two years at least, depending on how long the run they can get on the first one, but at least once a month.

JR: How do you define GoGo?

BJ: I haven't thought about that. I don't really, it's just to me like I said I grew up in it since I was little. It's been a like a major influence to me, but all I can say is a an influence, a major influence. I can't really define it. I haven't thought about that, I'll have to think about that one.

JR: Do you think all music performed by GoGo bands is GoGo?

BJ: In some way, shape, or form, yeah. Of course every group has their own interpretation of what GoGo is. It's a lot of younger groups that?s coming up, but obviously they?ve learned from some of the older groups like Trouble, EU, Rare Essence. So they just took their influence and made their own interpretation of what GoGo is... And that's the cool thing about it (last phrase is hard to hear). That's pretty much it.

JR: Do you GoGo can only be dance music?

BJ: Nah, wait a minute, explain that a little bit please...

JR: Okay, when you're hitting the beat, that's music designed to be danced. Do you think there's GoGo that isn't explicitly designed to be danced to?

BJ: You mean more so on the listening side?

JR: Yeah.

BJ: I think so. I think so because me personally I can sit down and listen to Chuck. He has more of a laid back flow with his vocals. So I can listen to Chuck as opposed to always wanting to get up and party. What we do is turn it up a little bit more than Chuck does. Not to say that it's better, it?s just different. I don?t think it's just designed to dance.

JR: What instrumentation should a GoGo band have at a minimum to be considered a GoGo band?

BJ: Definitely drums, Congos. You can get away with drums, and Congos, that?s a whole GoGo band right there for real.

JR: What do you think about of the current trend of some GoGo groups not having congas at all or barely? Like TCB for instance, they'll start off with one conga song and then it's all timbales and toms?

BJ: I mean that's cool 'cause it works for them because they cater to a much younger crowd. Then we do or what I'm used to. But whatever works, whatever works for them.

JR: What do you see as the future of GoGo?

BJ: I don't know. Until we get these politics right, this whole thing, everybody to me... I am going to be honest, there?s a lot of hate in GoGo. That's the sad, that's the downside to it for me. There's a lot of negativity outside of the music. Not so much with this band, but I have just experienced it with other groups out there, and I see it, and I hear about it. Until I think everybody gets that aspect together and pretty much comes together and know where we can really, really take this thing it will just be what it is.

JR: What do you think has to be done for the tradition of GoGo to be maintained?

BJ: I don't know. I think it's got a strong enough hint in this community, at least, just to be. I don?t think it's really going to take much to sustain it or maintain it as long as you?ve got younger cats coming up, wanting to start bands. There's a million bands out there for real, there's a lot of bands that play in the area, there's also a lot of bands that you don?t even hear about, that you wouldn?t even hear about.

JR: How did you learn to play music?

BJ: I was self taught, pretty much. Pretty much taught myself, listening to a lot of music, a lot of different genres of music.

JR: And what age did you start?

BJ: About thirteen, about thirteen. Twenty-some years, twenty-five, twenty-seven years.

JR: What made you decide to join a GoGo band?

BJ: Well, let Donnell tell it: he found me, and recruited me to a band, which he kind of did in a sense. I used to go see Rare Essence like faithfully. Donnell and I were with this other group, this little jazz group that used to play together like on the weekends. I guess they needed a bass player for a week or so, so he told me to come and audition. Back then, that was kind of like a dream to me, I was young.

JR: And what was the name of this band?

BJ: Rare Essence.

JR: No, I mean the jazz band.

BJ: We didn't really have a band, we just got together, jammed around. There really wasn't a name to the band, we didn't have gigs or nothing, just something we did to keep our chops up.

JR: What other GoGo groups and other groups did you belong to before 911?

BJ: Just Rare Essence. I used to play with this group called Icee Hott a long time ago.

Doc: You played in Icee Hott really? (This is not audible on the recording, but I remember it).

BJ: (Laughing). I sure did. GoGo groups, that?s probably it as far as GoGo groups.

JR: What about other groups, non-GoGo groups?

BJ: Other acts... I mean I?ve played on the circuit with Maxwell, I still play with Rahsaan Patterson as of this date, Me'Shell NdegeOcello, Sunshine Anderson, Arrested Development, Pure Soul, that's about it.

JR: Okay. What other side groups do you belong to right now?

BJ: Just basically 911, Rahsaan Patterson and this Gospel group called Heaven Sent (Note: Dwayne Lee and Pooh also belong), we do like just like on weekends. It's Gospel GoGo.

JR: And what's the point of that? Is that just to have another side to your music or...

BJ: Yeah, it keeps me busy, it keeps me mentally active with a lot of different types of songs, yeah...

JR: And is that who required you to learn twenty-eight songs? (This is a reference to a conversation on July 8th).

BJ: No, that was a showcase that I did with this other guy. I forgot I do this showcase from time to time with this guy Don Johnson.

JR: Uh huh.

BJ: He just pretty much put on a showcase for like say seven or eight women. Each woman comes up and does some songs.

JR: And that was the date of the Club Levels show?

BJ: Right, exactly. Exactly, that's why I was late.

JR: Okay. Do you do the opening set, the "Jazz" set as you guys call it as a conscious artistic choice or was it driven by giving the market what it wants?

BJ: Well, if I would have had my way, yeah, it would have been, it would have been that way. But it's a good thing that it came about because we never did anything like that. It's something kind of new for this particular band, not as individuals, but you know collectively. We've never really done a Jazz set. I think it's good for everybody to get to know, musicians to get to know take it as far as Jazz... Jazz you're free to do whatever.... (the last couple of phrases are uncertain as the DJ started playing right at that time and it is really hard to hear).

JR: How do you feel that 911's sound has evolved since you first started?

BJ: It's gotten a lot more mature. In my opinion, it's gotten a lot more mature. The maturity level.

JR: Okay. I've heard about the chauvinistic attitude that there used to exist in GoGo towards female musicians, but now there is a trend of groups having a female vocalist. Why do you think that is?

BJ: Brings a ___ to the group (I believe he's talking about a different element to the group, but not necessarily those words exactly). (I can't hear the second sentence ? Pooh was warming up on drums at this time). It attracts a whole 'nother crowd. Guys will come out and girls will respect it and come out and really hear it. (I can?t hear the sentence in between). Females, they?re not used to having... (I can't hear the finale sentence).

JR: Given the large of size of your band and your support people, that's a lot of people for money to spread around. Is money your primary interest for playing or what?

BJ: Well, no, it's not the primary interest. It's the primary necessity for me because this is, this is all I do. I don't work nine to five, this music thing is it right there. At the end of the day... for my work (difficult to hear due to Pooh?s warming up on drums).

JR: What other styles of music do you incorporate in yours?

BJ: Say it again?

JR: What other styles of music do you incorporate in your music?

BJ: Jazz, R&B, Gospel, GoGo, of course, Rock, whatever.

JR: What defines a good performance?

BJ: I just think it's more of an energy level, what you really put into it. It's not really so much what you're doing technically, or how many chops you got, you're showing the crowd that you are just as into it as they are or more.

JR: What do you think about how some people associate GoGo with fighting and violence?

BJ: Well, there is an association there because I've, I've dealt with that period for a while particularly with some other groups. There is an association, but that's part of the world. You can find fighting and violence with any and everything. That's just for real the world that we live in.

JR: How do you define Pockets & Sockets?

BJ: I don't, you can't define it. It is what it is.

JR: What do you think about the fact that there was an earlier group called Familiar Faces?

BJ: I didn't know that.

JR: Yeah, it was lead by Ivan Goff, it was in the '90s.

BJ: A GoGo group?

JR: Yeah, yeah. What do you think about the name change?

BJ: Familiar Faces?

JR: Yeah, from 911 to Familiar Faces.

BJ: I think it suits the band because they've seen a lot of people from different bands that have came together to form one band. A lot of guys, like myself, came from Rare Essence, so they know us maybe by name? at least one or two of us... Doc, he played with...

JR: Physical Wunders.

BJ: Physical Wunders, right. I was going to say Prophecy, but... yeah, I mean it suits the band. It suits the band definitely.

JR: And is there anything more you wanted to say or to ask me?

BJ: Anything more you wanted to ask me?

JR: No, that's it. Thanks.


BJ on the drums


Packy (barely visible), Doc, Mike, Pooh, Halima, Godfather, Donnell, BJ, Dwayne
All pictures taken by and Copyright - Jordan Rich

During the interview, BJ talked about being in Icee Hott and Doc was surprised. Meanwhile, Doc ate and talked with Telando. After my interview of BJ was over, I asked him about his picture of Doc with the fiberglass bass from 1985. He said that it was from his sister's high school year book. He had looked at the picture and said, "That looks just like Kenny!" I told him that Doc had said that he understood why Sugar Bear sold him the bass, he didn't like the sound. I also told BJ that Doc said he'd like to design his own bass at some point. Doc told me that Telando has thousands of live GoGo tapes that he would record for bands. He never sells them without the band's permission. I told him about how I hung out the night before with my friend G who is friends with Jimi Blake, the producer of the Metro World TV show. G said Jimi has a ton of film footage beyond what aired. Doc told me that BJ was a "baaad (meaning good) bass player." I talked with BJ about his playing the drums, which I filmed earlier at Xcalibur. He said, "I thought that your camera was a still camera." I said, "It's both". I asked BJ who his favorite bass players were; he mentioned around 20+ names. I asked Pooh what the purpose of the rug in the drum was, he said, "It muffles the sound." Halima, the guest vocalist last week, said hello to me and sat down over by me. The guy sitting next to me, whom I recognized as a regular, said, "Hey lightskin," and asked if I was filming again. I said, "No, I'm enjoying myself tonight." I also talked with Demetrius Owens and told him I had seen him on The Odyssey. I asked Doc about how Sugar Bear got his nickname. He said he didn't know, but that Bear's wife was known as "Honey Bear".

Familiar Faces
The line up for the first set was: Mike, Adia, Donnell, DP, Dwayne, Doc, Godfather, BJ, Pooh and Packy. They first performed Grover Washington Jr.'s Mr. Magic, which ended with a fiery drum solo by Pooh. Halima sat in for a couple of songs - Adia was stood by me and had what appeared to be a jealous look on her face as Halima sang. At one point, Mike sang a love song with Donnell on backup vocals. After the song, Mike said, "It's a great love song, you can sing it if you know the lyrics, even if your voice isn't good like Donnell." Donnell said, "See how he's dissing me?" Mike said, "He's being paranoid, I meant that Donnell (pointing to the regular sitting next to me)." Also, during the set, they performed Bobby Caldwell's What You Won't Do for Love. This is the first time they've performed it with Mike, they had performed it with a guest Oda Ray a few weeks ago at Xcalibur. They performed a longer-than-usual first set, over an hour. Donnell ended it with more joning on Quincy Carter, aimed at Don, "The Dallas Cowboys have a quarterback on the pipe. Clarence Carter. I think Rayful must be in the witness protection plan in Texas (I have to agree with a PA Palace poster who but it succinctly - "it doesn't matter how many people he squeals on, he will never see the light of day.") Where was Dexter Manley from? Houston, Texas. I will take bets on any game against the Cowboys, even if they are playing the Silverlake Boys Club." Even the Cowboys fans laughed.

At the break, I talked with Doc. He asked me, "How I as an outsider looking in thought about their first set, that they can be their own worst critics." I was honest: "It's not really my cup of tea. I prefer the throw down crank that Familiar Faces can do when they want. The happy hour set is entertaining, but I'm not really a fan of that music." In fact, that is one of the things I need to ask FF about still - since I don't listen to the originals that they cover, I don't recognize who did them (obviously Bobby Caldwell and Marvin Gaye I do recognize, I just don't follow current music very much). I went outside to talk with Michelle about interviewing her. I said, "I want to interview you from the fan's perspective. I want to get more embarrassing stories from you." Donnell turned around and said, "What?" They went in shortly afterwards and started the second set - one of their best crankers.

Bojack played in this set - I didn't even see him come in. He smiled at a girl in the audience and she came up and stood (and danced) next to him for the rest of the set. They concluded with their traditional closing song, Prince's Purple Rain. After they finished performing, Donnell told Nephew, "Stop talking to my girlfriend. Everything dead!" I talked with Michelle more about setting up an interview. Godfather and BJ went over to the piano and played the Charlie Brown theme. I talked with Doc, and then headed home.